This debate has taken place in London, Sheldonian Theatre, on 26th May 2010 . Guest Speakers:
Shaykh Hamza Yusuf Hanson and Professor Tariq Ramadan
In the post 9/11 world, it has grown to be an axiomatic truth that Islam needs to reform. Whether it is Western policy-makers seeking to protect themselves from Muslim extremists, humanitarian activists fighting to liberate silenced Muslims, or Muslims themselves responding to new paradigms faced in the 21st century, all are agreed that something within the tradition of Islam needs to change. The question though, is what, and perhaps more pertinently, how?
The drive to reform has spurred many projects with diverging aims and often contradictory trajectories, yet the notion of reform itself, despite being one of the most oft-repeated, remains ill-defined. Indeed, some reform projects have been judged to be wholly inattentive, if not injurious, to the Muslim communities they claim to be serving. Most recently, a House of Commons’ Committee highlighted the sensitivity of the issue, reporting that much of the effort towards reform has resulted in ‘stigmatising’ and ‘potentially alienating’ the Muslim community.
Considering widespread readiness to support Islamic reform, effective management and guidance must be provided to ensure the success of this pursuit. Thus, at this decisive historical juncture, it is crucial that voices which command the intellectual respect and trust of the Muslim public are engaged. Our two esteemed guest speakers, Hamza Yusuf and Tariq Ramadan, provide precisely that: the leading figures in this field, both are active and sensitive contributors to Western political discourse whilst being able to authoritatively communicate mainstream Islamic opinions to Western audiences.
Invitations for this event will extend to ministers, policy advisors, think tanks, journalists, theologians, scholars and other public figures with an interest in the field of Islamic Reform.
Drawing on the expertise of the speakers and that of the prospective audience, this instructive conference will therefore seek to clarify and answer: What is reform? What is legitimate reform? What are its spheres and remits? Why have reform movements been met with distrust and trepidation by the Muslim grass-roots? What roles, if any, should governments play in Islamic reform? What are the challenges they face?
Ultimately, this conference aims to address: What type of reform is needed, and how should this reform come into effect?
What an excellent discussion about one of the most important issues of our times, discussed by two of the leading intellectuals in the Western World.
We need more of these types of debates. Keep it coming.
Please see http://theobjectivethinker.com/2010/05/27/rethinking-islamic-reform-the-outcome/
Reflections on « Rethinking Islamic Reform »
http://nymansouri.blogspot.com/2010/05/reflections-on-rethinking-islamic.html
I’m sure the debate was fantastic, BUT the recording quality is very poor, I could not really hear anything!!
Salam Alaykum
You can watch the entire debate here: http://rethinkingislamicreform.co.uk/video
Enjoy! 🙂
“And this is what Islam has to say to the people of the Americas (and through them to all the non-white Westernized persons in the world): ‘Together, liberation theology more Latin American Left more Islam, we can prevent the seemingly imminent and inevitable bursting of the 3rd World War and re-establish a new order truly universal!’ ” — with these words I happen to end “What Islam has to say to the Americas”, a page of “The open way”: in summary, the result of an intense effort I have been doing throughout these last nearly 4 years to share with people the way God has allowed me to experience the message of the Koran.
So, with all humility, and only for the sake of Islam, I dare to invite here all the participants of this forum to take cognizance of such an approach, which tries to demonstrate (or, at least, to indicate) the factual existence of fundamental (historic and ideological) commonalities (already grasped by many but never related fully) between these 3 important movements favorable to some sort of fusion which could not result in nothing less than that so expected restoration of the original Islam. This, just because I could not here in one sole stroke to picture it to you in detail without threatening the consistency of the argument.
God be my witness that this appeal has nothing to do with personal promotion! And that, after your preliminary contact with such a surprisingly revolutionary proposal, I return here to discuss with you whatever you think to be necessary — if that come to be the case. Thanks for your patience.
http://www.martinsbenperrusi.com/crbst_7.html
There was a mention of the so-called « fatwa » of Mardin made by Ibn Taymiyya al-Harrani. Note that the fatwa in its entirety is invalid, mostly because Ibn Taymiyya himself was known as a heterodox and weak individual. Imam Ibn Hajar writes in al-Fatawa al-Hadithiyya:
» Ibn Taymiyya is a servant which Allah forsook, misguided, blinded, deafened, and debased. That is the declaration of the imams who have exposed the corruption of his positions and the mendacity of his sayings. Whoever wishes to pursue this must read the words of the mujtahid imam Abu al-Hasan (Taqi al-Din) al-Subki, of his son Taj al-Din Subki, of the Imam al-`Izz ibn Jama`a and others of the Shafi`i, Maliki, and Hanafi shaykhs… It must be considered that he is a misguided and misguiding innovator (mubtadi` dall mudill) and an ignorant who brought evil (jahilun ghalun) whom Allah treated with His justice. May He protect us from the likes of his path, doctrine, and actions!… Know that he has differed from people on questions about which Taj al-Din Ibn al-Subki and others warned us. »
To add to this, even the members of the Wahhabi sect, such as Rabi` ibn Hadi al-Madhkhali, agree that Ibn Taymiyya is not an authority, when he says:
« I didn’t find this hadith and I am afraid that Shaykh ul-Islam [Ibn Taymiyya]’s mind has gone to the other hadith of Abu Hurayra (ra), that says « Allah has angels wandering on earth, in addition to what is in the record of deeds of the people; and when they find a group remembering Allah, they call each other ‘come unto what you desired’ and they come. And they surround them until the lowest sky. Allahs says, ‘what were My servants doing when you left them?’ They say, ‘we left them thanking You, praising You and remembering You.’… » Imam Ahmad, 2/251, Tirmidhi 5/579, 130 Chapter of what has been narrated regarding what Allah has wandering angels on earth. Tirmidhi said the hadith is hasanan sahih, #3600, and Ad-Darimi 2/225, hadith #2777″
Of course, this is by the member of Ibn Taymiyya’s own sect, who called him weak. Amongst the most staunchest of those who called Ibn Taymiyya to have disbelieved is Imam Zahid al-Kawthari, may Allah have mercy upon him, who states in his « al-Maqalat »:
» In al-Ta’sis fi Radd Asas al-Taqdis (« The Laying of the Foundation: A Refutation of al-Razi’s « The Foundation of Allah’s Sanctification ») Ibn Taymiyya says: « Al-`arsh (the throne) in language means al-sarir (elevated seat or couch), so named with respect to what is on top of it, just as the roof is so named with respect to what is under it. Therefore, if the Qur’an attributes a throne to Allah, it is then known that this throne is, with respect to Allah, like the elevated seat is with respect to other than Allah. This makes it necessarily true that He is on top of the throne. » So then the throne is, for Ibn Taymiyya, Allah’s seat (maq`ad)- Exalted is He from such a notion! »
Ibn Taymiyya is also well noted for his aberrant and heretodox opinions. The following is a listed from Imam Ibn Hajar’s al-Fatawa al-Hadithiya of many of Ibn Taymiyya’s wrong opinions:
1. that whoso violates the consensus commits neither disbelief (kufr) nor grave transgression (fisq);
2. that our Lord is subject to created events (mahallun li al-hawadith) – glorified, exalted, and sanctified is He far above what the depraved ascribe to Him!
3. that He is complex or made of parts (murakkab), His Entity standing in need similarly to the way the whole stands in need of the parts, elevated is He and sanctified above that!
4. that the Qur’an is created in Allah’s Entity (muhdath fi dhatillah), elevated is He above that!
5. that the world is of a pre-eternal nature and exists with Allah since pre-eternity as an « ever-abiding created object » (makhluqan da’iman), thus making it necessarily existent in His Entity (mujaban bi al-dhat) and not acting deliberately[GH1] (la fa`ilan bi al-ikhtyar), elevated is He above that!12
6. his suggestions of Allah’s corporeality, direction, displacement, (al-jismiyya wa al-jiha wa al-intiqal), and that He fits the size of the Throne, being neither bigger nor smaller, exalted is He from such a hideous invention and wide-open disbelief, and may He forsake all his followers, and may all his beliefs be scattered and lost!
7. his saying that the fire shall go out (al-nar tafni),13
8. and that Prophets are not sinless (al-anbiya’ ghayr ma`sumin),
9. and that the Prophet — Allah bless and greet him — has no special status before Allah (la jaha lahu) and must not be used as a means (la yutawassalu bihi),14
10. and that the undertaking of travel (al-safar) to the Prophet — Allah bless and greet him — in order to perform his visitation is a sin, for which it is unlawful to shorten the prayers,15 and that it is forbidden to ask for his intercession in view of the Day of Need,
11. and that the words (alfaz) of the Torah and the Gospel were not substituted, but their meanings (ma`ani) were.
Some said: « Whoever looks at his books does not attribute to him most of these positions, except that whereby he holds the view that Allah has a direction, and that he authored a book to establish this, and forces the proof upon the people who follow this school of thought that they are believers in Allah’s corporeality (jismiyya), dimensionality (muhadhat), and settledness (istiqrar). » That is, it may be that at times he used to assert these proofs and that they were consequently attributed to him in particular. But whoever attributed this to him from among the imams of Islam upon whose greatness, leadership, religion, trustworthiness, fairness, acceptance, insight, and meticulousness there is agreement – then they do not say anything except what has been duly established with added precautions and repeated inquiry. This is especially true when a Muslim is attributed a view which necessitates his disbelief, apostasy, misguidance, and execution. Therefore if it is true of him that he is a disbeliever and an innovator, then Allah will deal with him with His justice, and other than that He will forgive us and him »
Also, even Sulayman ibn Sahman has listed 53 issues where Ibn Taymiyya has gone against the 4 Imams.
Ibn Taymiyya’s so-called « fatwa » is thus invalid, un-applicable, and against the authority of the `ulema of Ahl al-Sunnah and even the Wahhabis (who are heterodox and deviant) recognize Ibn Taymiyya’s heterodoxy.
And Allah and His Messenger Knows Best